“Euro,” “Wii,” and now “iPad.”

Posted January 27th, 2010 by Howard Tayler

Apple announced that their keyless, touch-screen tablet offering will be called the iPad, and the iTampon jokes are flying. This is to be expected, but it does not mean that iPad is a bad name. Not for Apple, it isn’t. Apple can make this work just fine.

Marketing 201: if you’re a small company, your product name will be defined by language. But if you’re a huge company (or a government,) language can be redefined by your product name.

Two recent examples: first, many Greeks objected to the name “Euro” for the European Union’s international currency because in their language it sounded an awful lot like “oúra,” which is their word for urine. (Of course, the abbreviation for “pennies” in the UK has been “p” [pronounced "pee"] for a long time, and nobody accidentally fishes change out of the urinal.) After the initial kerfluffle the confusion just went away. Europe’s currency is the Euro, and that word makes only a very, very few of us think of urine.

Second, the “Wii.” Again with the potty-humor. But Nintendo, while not quite as big as Europe, had the marketing dollars to reshape language. It’s been years since I made jokes about getting carpal tunnel from playing with my Wii. The jokes stopped being funny (assuming they ever started) and besides, now you have to actually think about it to make the connection. “Wii” only means “Nintendo game console” now. Language changed because Nintendo told it to.

And now Apple wants us to call this device of theirs an “iPad.” Guess what? The iTampon jokes are going to stop being funny (again, assuming they ever started) because Apple has the market presence to reshape language. Just like “Pod” now suggests MP3-related technology and services (“podcast,” for starters), “Pad” is going to mean “keyboardless portable notebook computer with a touch-screen.”

Were there women involved in naming this thing “iPad?” I’m sure there were. And I bet that they’ve all taken Marketing 201, and knew exactly what they were doing.

Whether or not the device lives up to the hype is another matter entirely.

And now, the obligatory closing of the loop:

“Waaugh! Somebody get me an iPad! My Wii is getting Euro all over the coffee-table!”

Explore posts in the same categories: Industry News, Internet

53 Comments on ““Euro,” “Wii,” and now “iPad.””

  1. Howard Tayler Says:

    “iPhone” is another good example. Do any of you remember that this was actually a Cisco TRADEMARK prior to Apple absconding with the word? I’m sure Apple paid heavily for it, but they got away with nevertheless.

  2. Fibonacci Says:

    But the word “pad” has already been used in a similar fashion in science fiction. In the Star Wars universe they have datapads, and in Star Trek, “PADD” is an acronym for “personal access display device.”

  3. Howard Tayler Says:

    @Fibonacci: I don’t see your point. At the end of this, Apple is going to own the word “pad” in the same way they own the word “pod.” Other meanings (tampon, stack of paper, mattress layer, etc) will become satellites.

    Sure, the word had been used Apple’s way in Science Fiction, but that’s not nearly the same as the ubiquity we’re going to see shortly.

  4. zippthorne Says:

    @Fibonacci:

    Yeah, I have to agree. That was the first thing I thought of when I saw the name and form factor. In fact, the main difference as far as I can see is that the PADDs were less capable, and about 3x as thick due to the nausea inducing medical-grade plastic (gray or “flesh” color, lots of flat single-color surfaces, with minimum radius of all corners larger than a Duplo block) construction instead of sexy glass and milled aluminum.

    I’d rather have ePaper for book reading, one of the mentioned applications, although I can definitely see this replacing a light-duty laptop with the addition of a bluetooth keyboard and a fashionably designed tabletop stand accessories.

  5. Howard Tayler Says:

    The hot technology that I expect to see in the 4th Gen iPad is a texture that “lifts” from the screen to create touchable keys for the keyboard. The tech already exists, it’s just a matter of getting the cost down.

    The big drawback of typing on a touch-screen is that you cannot truly touch-type. With this you could.

  6. richv Says:

    I still think Microsoft should have called its entry in the Cell Phone Market the “Phune.”

  7. steamfoxen Says:

    Wasn’t this tried before, when tablets were just becoming feasible?

    They were called “slates” or something similar, and used either a stylus or a touchscreen to do everything. Problem being the handwriting recognition drivers were poor performers in the day, so data entry was slow and troublesome, and the difficulty of typing on a touchscreen has already been brought up.

    I’m on Win7 now, using an HP convertible laptop. I use the stylus and the tablet mode with OneNote to take my notes in class, then organize and manipulate them after class into coherent study pages. This setup is /amazing/, but the hinge and the latch on the laptop are weak points I’d really love to eliminate.

    A non-touch screen (or a touchscreen I can turn off to use with a digitizer stylus; I rest my hand on the screen while I write, so a touch screen data entry is a no go) slate would be practically ideal for me and my use. A USB or bluetooth keyboard and mouse if I want to use a keyboard, and handwriting for everything else…

    I just don’t want to have to mess with an Apple product to get it.

  8. Sam Says:

    steamfoxen: Funny, some of us don’t want to have to mess with Windows.

    That said, I don’t think I’m gonna get an iPad. I don’t know whether Apple has made a colossal mistake, or whether they’ve cleverly spotted an unfilled market niche.

  9. Varion Says:

    I just laughed my head off at the ‘obligatory closing of the loop’. Personally, I still like good old books and paper and my desktop computer, but I suppose that puts me nearly a decade behind the times.

  10. hida_dragonbane Says:

    I still don’t see ANY use for this thing other than as a PADD emulator, until and unless they up the sensitivity such that it can be used as a Wacom Tablet drawing tool by actual artists.

  11. csadn Says:

    My technologically-oriented SO was explaining to me “the feminine-
    hygiene-product jokes are the *least* of the things wrong with this
    POJ” — failings to include Lack of Robustness (it’s plastic, and not
    waterproof; this for an item which is supposed to be used in all the
    places where, and by all the people who, used to use books and
    such — like Children in Bathrooms…), Awful Ergonomics (no actual
    keyboard, so typists will wind up with numb fingers; too awkward
    to actually carry one-handed; no way to carry it with a strong grip
    without accidentally hitting the touchscreen), Fascist Software (can’t
    use Flash; can’t use any software besides Apple apps)….

    In short: Steve Jobs said “we can’t make a tablet PC for under
    $500″, and the iPad proves it.

  12. whitemage12380 Says:

    @Varion

    It puts you exactly where you want to be – and who can argue with that?

  13. zippthorne Says:

    Ok, first of all it’s cheaper than a “real” laptop, but it’s power level is such that you won’t be playing games on it. You might be able to play videos on it, though, and you’ll definitely have enough horsepower to play keynote presentations on it, so one use that immediately comes to mind is as a portable presentation device.

    It definitely has some overlap with the iPhone, netbooks, and laptops, so it’ll probably be a preferred choice for users with a certain class of needs, and I can already think of a few things where it would be the preferred form factor for my needs.

    That said, I’m not going to buy that thing *and* a laptop. Especially not if they’re both apple products, it’s about the budget: not having a big enough one.

  14. WEKM Says:

    ARGHHHH! Howard, I hate you so much right now. Your closing of the loop resulted in me launching chunky clam chowder out my nose. Pain and clean up, never a good combo with laughter.

    I have been fighting against the Apple tide for a long time, but I am swiftly loosing ground. The iPhone has proven to be a highly capable phone with lots of support, other than by the carrier AT&T, and if the iPad is equally as capable, I may have to cave at last.
    If they ever offer the iPhone on another network that would actually back them up, I may have to get one of those too.

  15. jj42 Says:

    And now there is one more who will think about visiting the little boys room when talk is on the European currency….

    About the jokes, they have started:
    http://failblog.org/2010/01/27/name-fail-photoshop-win/

  16. jj42 Says:

    and I can’t help liking this one (no, I am not really an iFan, Tux has won my heart):

    “It actually has a robust power source; it is powered almost entirely by the user’s sense of self-importance.”

  17. Sam Says:

    WEKM: You chose to eat soup while reading something Howard wrote. You have only yourself to blame.

  18. Dug Says:

    Quote:
    “Howard Tayler Says:
    January 27th, 2010 at 10:35 pm

    The hot technology that I expect to see in the 4th Gen iPad is a texture that “lifts” from the screen to create touchable keys for the keyboard. The tech already exists, it’s just a matter of getting the cost down.”

    I expect the 4th gen iPad to do what you expected the 1st gen to do, just like the iPhone did.

    I like the post by the way, especially the “closing of the loop”.

  19. Fibonacci Says:

    @Howard

    I’m not arguing against how the product will take over the use of the word; just saying that among sci-fi fans (which probably have a higher percentage among those who will buy this product) the word already has the correct connotations. I suspect that went into the choice of name by Apple. At least, when I hear the word “pad” what comes to mind first is a small, flat, data-access device, rather than a feminine hygiene product.

  20. Chris Barrett Says:

    @Howard

    And of course, in several of the thicker British accents, Pennies sounds a lot like the technical term for a part of the male genitalia. Though we do keep our change in our pants and attempt to use it to impress women, so I suppose it has a likeness.

    ”Is that a roll of pennies in your pocket?” comes out as a yes either way

  21. Bill Allen Says:

    I couldn’t help but notice the last two panels of today’s strip

    “High prices and they are making up words….back away without making eye contact.”

    I know Mr. Taylor puts a lot of work into his story, and did not just change the script on-the-fly, but I wonder if this could be considered Prophetic….

  22. scott040877 Says:

    All I gotta say, Howard, is Star Trek fans everywhere are rejoicing at seeing the PADD come to life.

    Funny thing is, who new that the future envisioned by Gene Rodenberry would be realized by Apple technology?

    I suppose that having an iEnterprise (like in the reinvisioned Star Trek movie) is way more preferable to a Windows based space ship.

    Seriously – you’re catapulting through space at relativistic speeds with a thin shell of metal protecting you from the certain death that is the vacuum between worlds – which operating system do you want running the controls? I use Windows on earth… where it can’t kill me.

    :)

    -Scott

  23. Austin Shackles Says:

    I wouldn’t mind betting that Nintendo new exactly what they were doing calling their new product “wee”, ‘cos all the toilet humour means that it’s so much more of a household word.

    It’s also stunningly good marketing to create a small hand-held gadget which docks with a bazillion special devices, like guitars, drum sets, steering wheels, bats, guns and so on – all of which no doubt make a good profit.

    I won’t be buying the iPad though – 2 reasons, one is that, like all apple stuff it’ll be expensive (although granted it’ll probably be pretty good quality) in terms of bang-per-buck (remember the first iPhone, and how low-spec it was?) and secondly, I’ve got no time for apple and all their DRM stuff, for the same reason, I won’t be buying into blue-ray. I’ve no objection to paying for content, if the content merits it, but I’m damned if I’ll have something which I can ONLY get stuff from apple.

  24. jkcarroll Says:

    Of course, I remember when the Euro was originally going to be called the “European Monetary Unit”, or EMU. Imagine — the currency of the future tied to a large, flightless bird, that keeps its head to the ground searching for food instead of looking ahead… Then again, maybe that WAS an appropriate name!

  25. Howard Tayler Says:

    Actually, one of the choices was “Ecu” (European Currency Unit), but that got shot down because it sounded too much like the German word for “cow.”

    “Euro” was a bottom-of-the-barrel pick. The thing that I don’t think the government types fully understood was that THEY COULD PICK WHATEVER THEY WANTED. Language would shift, because they would literally have all the money in the European Union backing their decision to redefine a word, or create a brand new word.

    But that’s the democratic process for you. The decision was made by people who didn’t understand the power they were wielding, and many much better (IMO) names were passed over in order to prevent upsetting somebody. A decade later all that would have been forgotten.

  26. palad Says:

    Not to be pedantic, but I believe the Brits use ‘p’ as an abbreviation for pence, rather than pennies. And while they both come from the same root, pence is rightfully a word on its own and deserves recognition. Down with pennies! Up with pence!

  27. jkcarroll Says:

    So I could have petitioned the naming committee to name the new currency after my girlfriend, Tatiana? Now THAT would have been a birthday gift!

  28. steamfoxen Says:

    @Sam:

    I’m not particularly interested in getting into an OS fight with anyone. I’m happy with my Win7 tablet: if you’re happy with what you have, fine. Don’t try converting me, or you’ll get nothing but a fight and still not succeed.

    My experiences with Apple products have been uniformly bad. Thus, I will vote with my patronage against them. If your experiences with Windows are such that you are in the opposite case, then you’re free to do the same.

    But do not hold up your chosen facilitator/company/brand as THE ONE TRUE BRAND, because it isn’t. They make mistakes and are capable of putting out crappy products just like everyone else.

    Heck, look at Toyota. Reputation for “problem free, user friendly” products that just got shot in the groin by a 5+ million vehicle recall, a sale stoppage, and owners worried about a potentially lethal problem with their car going out of control.

  29. steamfoxen Says:

    A few more comments about my “ideal slate,” if I may.

    Synching capability: I don’t know if Apple has a similar program, but with OneNote I can synch my notebooks between computers, transferring them automatically. Being able to carry the slate to school, take notes, then come home and synch them over to my desktop would mean that I could do all my keyboard intensive work at home on a full size keyboard and mouse and screen, rather than through cable-madness of added peripherals to a laptop/slate.

    /Excellent/ battery life: If I’m going to be writing on this thing, holding it in my arm or on my lap, I need to be free from the power cord. I’m not going to go buying one of of these things to play games, so video performance wouldn’t be a big deal, but a long battery life, sanely placed power cord (in my case, that would be on one of the narrow ends, as I hold the thing like an 8.5×11 notepad…) socket, and enough oomph to handle presentation animations and some moderate quality movie playback (I’m thinking embedded videos, not DVD watching).

    Possibly multiple batteries, or easily swapped batteries?

    Stylus holder: My 2730p has a little slot built into it to hold the stylus when I’m not using it. It’s managed to keep me from losing the darned thing for the past year, which I’m very, very grateful for. Also, possibly allow the thing to house multiples, so you can have different types or tips at hand?

  30. MartianBanshee Says:

    @Steamfoxen: Heck, look at Toyota. Reputation for “problem free, user friendly” products that just got shot in the groin by a 5+ million vehicle recall, a sale stoppage, and owners worried about a potentially lethal problem with their car going out of control.

    Sounds like they’re past the need for iPad and need the full insertion iPon for those “heavy days”

  31. steamfoxen Says:

    … Yow. That’s a shot into the bow, not across it. :D

  32. Sam Says:

    scott040877: “Seriously – you’re catapulting through space at relativistic speeds with a thin shell of metal protecting you from the certain death that is the vacuum between worlds – which operating system do you want running the controls? I use Windows on earth… where it can’t kill me.

    Actually, getting the Marble of Doom at the wrong time could be pretty dangerous too.

    jkcarroll: And a euro is a large kangaroo, of the species Macropus robustus. So they still ended up naming it after an Australian animal.

    steamfoxen: “I’m not particularly interested in getting into an OS fight with anyone.

    Fine with me. Every OS sucks. Though perhaps not quite as badly as they did back when this video was made. (Start at about 1:25 – there’s a lot of rambling at the start.)

  33. MikeWilliamson Says:

    So, is the iPad bleeding edge technology?

  34. MikeWilliamson Says:

    And I have a good used $300 laptop and a good used $50 iPod, that handle anything I need to do. I see no need for this product whatsoever.

    Of course, I’m not that kind of geek. What was it The Onion said?

    “I’ll buy pretty much anything with Mac’s name on it.”

  35. Dan Diamond » On iLanguage Says:

    [...] Tayler, Blógünder Schlock, [...]

  36. PhoenixOasis Says:

    So…who else is interested in seeing Brad eat 12+ lbs of food?

  37. PhoenixOasis Says:

    Nick, actually, before I get flamed. Curses. Still, I’d be interested in seeing all the big guys at a buffet. That, or 5500 grams of chupaqueso ingested by Howard.

  38. Howard Tayler Says:

    For you to see 5500 grams of chupaqueso ingested by me you would need to follow me around for well over a year.

  39. richv Says:

    Five years ago MS was pushing the “Smart Display,” which was a Windows CE-based computer which used the Remote Desktop Protocol (RDP) to act as a remote I/O device for a Windows computer. I Beta tested one and would have happily bought one if it wasn’t more expensive than a good laptop. It had a (switchable) touch screen and USB sockets for optional keyboard and mouse. The battery was good for 6-8 hours, and it was as powerful as your own computer, since all it did was act as a remote display.

  40. zippthorne Says:

    @scott040877: “All I gotta say, Howard, is Star Trek fans everywhere are rejoicing at seeing the PADD come to life.”

    The 3ish inch rigid shell floppy disk was “predicted” by the original series, and later Apple was one of the early companies to move to it from 5 1/4″ floppies. This is mentioned in the TNG tech manual, though it may be apocryphal: I’m not sure that star trek writers in the late 80s had ever actually seen a non-apple personal computer….

    http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/20/microsoft-surface-one-day-your-computer-will-be-a-big-ass-table/

  41. Obakeinu Says:

    As rehashed above, marketing can ‘own’ a name, and a ‘real world’ reputation can either ‘enshrine’ something, or turn it into a steaming pile of doo doo.

    OS wars? Feh. If it has utility for your needs, then have at it. The complexity of the reality tends to make a mockery of ‘perfect’ systems/solutions anyway.

    Concerning the iPad, mixed reviews at best. Gizmodo had a pretty brutal ‘dissenting’ review and I’ve heard that G4 TV’s AotS was less than impressed as well. It seemed that the ‘tech geek’ community was less than impressed.

    That being said, I’m seeing a common repeating pattern concerning Apple. Release a product, market the ‘buzz’, admit it’s ‘less than perfect, but we’re going release a better model in the near future’.

    Rinse and repeat as needed. ;)

    The results? Endless ‘upgrades’ demanding MORE money for features that should have been there in the FIRST PLACE. Instead of ‘planned obsolescence’, Apple goes with ‘minimal utility’, AND gets away with it.

    Sorta like Warhamster 40k fans: perpetually racing about with fist-fulls of greenbacks, seeking the ‘perfect solution’ for their particular ‘needs’.

    The similarity in their business models provide me with no end of amusement.

    Hmmmmmmm.

    I wonder what Steve Jobs and his Marketing Team do in their spare time?

  42. Howard Tayler Says:

    Actually, the Apple plan seems to fit the pattern of embracing disruptive innovation. That pattern suggests that the 1st generation of the “next big thing” is going to fail to meet most existing customers’ needs.

    But, if it’s truly a disruptive innovation and not a clever failure, it will create demand for itself. In short, it appeals to new customers, or to a new niche within existing customers.

    I think both the iPod and iPhone did this quite well. Both of them turned the market completely on its ear, and established marketplace dominance for Apple. Whether the iPad works the same way remains to be seen.

    If you stop thinking about the iPad as a thing that cannot replace a laptop, and start thinking about it as a better Kindle you’ll see where it’s headed. I’m sure it’ll eventually deliver laptop-like functionality, but for now it’s going to appeal to a different customer segment. Anid within that segment I expect it to dominate.

    Note: I don’t actually WANT one.

  43. Hoomi Says:

    The Woot! folks blogged about the iPad the other day, and the comment about the iTampon jokes reminded me of a link they posted. Mad TV played with the “iPad” gag some four years ago or more, and their take on it can be seen on Youtube.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFNQE_TzQNI&

    Caveat: Mad TV is not known for the most tasteful humor, so if jokes on a menstrual theme offend you, it’s probably better to skip watching the video.

    As far as wanting an iPad, I’m still devoid of an iPod or iPhone, and have no hurry to get either of those, either. The Kindle and other such e-book readers are cool, but I’m still enough of a Luddite that I prefer holding a printed, bound book in my hands to read. Now, if I had a job that required lots of time traveling, a Kindle or similar device would be very nice, in being able to carry a large library of books in less space than a single paperback.

    For now, if I want to read an e-book, I’ll do so on my laptop.

  44. Hoomi Says:

    Oops. That should read, “…lots of time spent traveling,” So far, there are no jobs requiring lots of traveling through time.

  45. NaOH Says:

    I think a few people have got the whole ‘pee’, ‘penny’ and ‘pence’ thing backwards.

    My understanding is that the term ‘to pee’ is related to the phrase ‘to spend a penny’. The link between urinating and spending a penny comes from the 19th Century England, where public toilets were established to combat the problem of people urinating in the street. This was made more practical by the invention of a coin operated door lock as seen here: http://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/broughttolife/objects/display.aspx?id=5938

    As mentioned in the link, access to the toilet would cost one penny, and the term ‘to spend a penny’ grew out of that.

    The abbreviation for ‘penny’ is ‘P’, or ‘pee’. “50P for a Lion bar? Weren’t they 35P just last week?”

    As for penny, pennies and pence.

    In British English, when talking monetary values ‘penny’ is singular and ‘pence’ is plural. You do not use the term ‘pennies’ when talking about currency values. The term ‘pennies’ is only used when talking about a quantity of coins all valued at one penny. “This roll of pennies has a value of thirty pence.”

    Was that a bit too pedantic?

  46. NaOH Says:

    “For you to see 5500 grams of chupaqueso ingested by me you would need to follow me around for well over a year.”

    For a moment I thought of it being observed in a ‘post-digested’ state.

  47. Sam Says:

    Hoomi: If I had a job that required lots of time travelling, I’d… Oh. Never mind.

    NaOH: My dictionary gives a simpler etymology. Yes, “pee” is derived from the letter P, but it doesn’t stand for penny.

  48. Sam Says:

    Hoomi: It’d be fun to carpool with the Doctor, though.

  49. Hoomi Says:

    It’d be my luck, though, to end up carpooling with Bill and Ted, and end up stuck in the Iron Maiden. Bogus!

    Since the dictionary etymology for “pee” is derived from “piss”, which has a rather long existence in the English language, it’s quite likely “pee” may be one of those terms that plays on something of the double-entendre. Incidentally, “piss” was not always considered a disreputable term, as it was used several times in the King James translation of the Bible. (ref: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Samuel+25:21-23&version=KJV )

  50. AKRainshine Says:

    I had a computer that I could write on, read books on, and play games on. It fit in my pocket, and it was from Palm. I enjoyed it a lot — I could download things from Gutenberg and put on there to read, keep my photos, etc. It worked regardless of whether I was working (No internet access) or if I was in an airport. Unfortunately, it recently died, and apparently they don’t make them anymore — if you want something like that, you have to pay through the nose, and have a data plan/internet. I’m a bit sad…

  51. Psychosomatic Says:

    Let me first establish my position on Apple products: I hate them. I hate all things Crapple with the heat of a thousand burning suns. You could not give me a Crapple product and expect me to do anything with it but put it through a Blendtec, one smashed chunk at a time.

    (NOTE: I do still have a Mini Smack in a box somewhere; it was loaned out to somebody who already had a Mac contamination and the thing could do no more damage. If somebody ever asks me to develop a Smack application I can recall the box and work on that.)

    Crapple makes products that are all flash and no substance. Low performance, low value per dollar, low usefulness, low life expectancy, low compatibility with non-Apple products. There isn’t anything Apple makes that is not matched or exceeded by other products on the market for less money. Phones, MP3 players, computers, anything. I expect this tampon thingy to be more of the same.

    You know all those TV ads about “apps” available only on the iPhone? Purest, unmitigated hogwash. Palm, Symbian, and WinMob phones have had all that stuff and more for years. I particularly like the way I can sync my WinMob 6.5 phone from HTC with my WinXP Pro desktop, the way I used to sync my Palm with my Win2K Pro desktop. And a lot of FREE applications for these platforms, too — unlike Crapple.

    Anyway, netbooks are getting smaller and phones are getting more powerful. Pretty soon there will be a meeting in the middle that will leave Crapple gasping for breath when some Microschlock product or other makes the handheld phone/notebook/reader a commodity device. An open system on such a device will put the nail in the Crapple coffin once and for all.

    Let’s hope.

  52. bryan314 Says:

    @AKRainshine: There are still handhelds out there that aren’t phones. Most of them, unfortunately, walk (it’s too slow for actual running) some mickeysoft OS, though. I run on an iPaq2215, for example. They still exist independent of phones.

    Ah! They DO still make palm devices. Check: http://www.google.com/products/catalog?rlz=1C1CHMI_enUS358US358&sourceid=chrome&q=palm+os&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=6294311317347541920&ei=jC1qS9_PJ4z8NYC2pIEG&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CCMQ8wIwAw#ps-sellers

    $300 new, but they have used ones available.

  53. Mason Wheeler Says:

    I was at work a few days ago when this topic came up among a bunch of coworkers, and someone made a rather predictable “pad” joke.

    I mentioned how Howard Tayler had predicted that the word “pad” was going to be coopted by Apple’s enormous marketing and image-shaping might, much the way “Wii” had by Nintendo. Then François spoke up.

    “To me, that still means ‘yes.’”

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